Yard signs are appearing in the Carytown area in opposition to the planned conversion of the Verizon Building. Let’s think through this.
The opposition to the conversion of a functionally obsolete property that has been for sale for quite a while is that some people don’t want to see Carytown become “big boxed.” But if there is a single user for 45,000 square feet, it’s not really a “big box.” It’s more of a mid-size box. Kroger is in the process of expanding, which is a stone’s throw away from the property in question and much larger. So is the opposition all about the size of the building, or is it about something else?
From the developer’s perspective (full disclosure: I don’t represent the developer or a prospective tenant at this time), they will be taking the Verizon Building, an ugly duckling, and greatly improving its appearance.
My initial concern was regarding to traffic issues. A study has been concluded, and if it passes scrutiny this issue should become a moot point. I remember when the Walgreens was being built at Thompson and Ellwoood. There were similar concerns about traffic congestion, and that congestion didn’t materialize. Parking is being addressed at the proposed Carytown Place with onsite parking.
The developers have also addressed the appearance of the building so that it is compatible with the surrounding neighborhood. I would suggest to the local homeowners that before they place a “No Big Box” yard sign on their property they consider the long-range value of their property. Would they prefer that the old Verizon Building remain vacant and continue to deteriorate, or would they be better served by a revitalized property that will enable them to walk to an enhanced Carytown shopping area? I would predict that the value of the surrounding properties would benefit by the proposed development.
Finally, with regard to the hysteria of a Wal-Mart being the tenant, forget it. There is only one Wal-Mart concept that would fit the footprint, and that is their Neighborhood Market supermarket concept, which includes a pharmacy with a drive-thru. I don’t believe that concept would work on this site. If Whole Foods wants to compete with a larger Kroger, a Martin’s and Ellwood Thompson, good luck to them. In my opinion, the pie is too small for them to succeed unless they force a competitor such as Martin’s out of the market. Notice I chose Martin’s, not Ellwood Thompson, because Martin’s has an undersize store to begin with and they would have a difficult time expand. For argument’s sake, if Whole Foods did arrive and Martin’s left, wouldn’t that be a great opportunity for smaller shops to backfill the Martin’s space?
Now before anyone comments that I am looking to put Martin’s out of business, that’s not my intent. I simply want to point out that retail has a way of adapting to changing conditions. Just look at how many times The Shops at Willow Lawn — and indeed Carytown itself — have been reinvented.
Remember, the sooner the city allows Carytown Place to proceed, the sooner the city will be able to collect the higher real estate taxes that this development will provide. This is a win-win situation for Carytown and Richmond. Perhaps what the Carytown merchants should do is petition the city to use these extra tax dollars for additional Carytown enhancements.
Great commentary. My sense is that the entire ‘Don’t Big Box Carytown’ effort is just Ellwood Thompson’s trying to limit competition. So why should they not have to compete like the rest of us? Very compelling points about the nearby Kroger. If I’m not mistaken, that will be about 80, 000 square feet. The Carytown Place project is half that size. The Ellwood Thompson opponents need to back off and improve their products. I go there at least once a week. The prices are high and the selection is limited. They always have the same stuff on the hot bar and it’s expensive. I like the fresh vegetables and organic selection, but the amount of shelf space they have is so limited. We could use some more choices.
it should be known that the argument that the building could be converted for other uses (i.e. residential) is also a moot point. i know a pretty sophisticated developer did extensive pre-development work to explore this strategy and at the end of the day he would not move forward. i don’t know the details of why, but my guess is that the numbers did not work and there is likely an over supply of condos in the area. jmtc…
Thank you for injecting thoughful objective analysis into the discussion! I live on Ellwood and I’m excited about giving life to an abandoned building and expanding my shopping choices. Infill development is prefereable to me than further destructive suburban sprawl. The building will look better after the developer fixes it up and it will continue to screen the view of Walgreens and Ellwood Thompsons from folks who life on Nansmond. Nothing changes there except the view gets better becasue the developer will add more landscaping and street amenities like bike racks, benches.
It’s not that we think you are trying to put Martins out of business, but because of things you have written in the past WE STILL DONT TRUST YOU, BRIAN GLASS! Not as a columnist, real estate agent or as a person. YOU STILL OWE THE OREGON HILL HISTORIC NEIGHBORHOOD AN APOLOGY!
Richmond Bizsense- please get rid of this guy!
I agree with the author. The only reason for this non-troversy is that Ellwood doesn’t want Whole Foods. Converting an eyesore to an attractive business that creates jobs and tax revenue is good for Carytown and good for Richmond.
For a “progressive” business Ellwood should know this. It is likely their business won’t see much change, the ladies will still show up in their 12 MPG Range Rovers, buy overpriced organic food and pat themsleves on their backs about how “progressive” they are driving back to their 5,000 sq. ft. Windsor Farms homes.
I’d like to see Carytown or the city develop the space into an indoor farmers market that could be run year-round, similar to the big market in Philadelphia, or Seattle. Lots of choices and definitely supporting our local farms and artisans.
Finally, an objective, coherent essay on the proposed Carytown Place! The hoopla is so unbelievably unfounded it’s not even funny. Carytown, while it really is Richmond’s signature destination, has been limping along on its locally owned, funky fresh reputation for almost 10 years. What it needs now is a reason for the suburbanites to make the giant trek (you know, of 15 minutes) to get there and find it. If it takes a Whole Foods to convince some east-ender or Mechanicsville resident to realize Carytown isn’t so far away, then so be it. They come for groceries, then come back later to shop the local merchants. The Don’t Big Box campaign is nothing other than Ellwood Thompson’s thinly-veiled attempt to drive out competition.
And for everyone screaming about “support your local business,” how many of you do your shopping online instead of trekking to Carytown? Stores don’t close because they’re making too much money. I work in Carytown, and am stunned at the customers who come in, try on, check things out, then walk out and buy the same merchandise online, just to save $10. Then are shocked when they come back 6 months later and find that store out of business. Bring on the national chains if it’s going to bring customers to Carytown!
I live on Ellwood and have a hard time believing that there will be no traffic impact as a result of this development. Changing an office space to a retail space will significantly change traffic patterns and volume. My understanding is that the traffic study, paid for by the developer, used assumptions that in every case minimized the projected traffic impact.
In addition, the final plans include an entrance/exit on Ellwood, about 50 yards from the stoplight and Ellwood and Nansemond, which is a hazzard, given the speed of traffic on Ellwood.
Disclosure: I am not a regular shopper at Ellwood Thompson’s, just one of the many residents that live by this property who oppose the development.
I’m all for bringing jobs, tax revenue and competition to the market. Competition drives the market. Maybe Ellwood Thompson’s should drop the “don’t big box carytown” campaign and start using that money to treat their employee’s better. I’ve heard stories about their “love” of their employees, ha!
The parking and congestion comparison to walgreens isn’t valid. There are walgreens every mile aound here where WF is much more scarce so there would be more visitors from out of the immediate area. Other than that good points. I’m for the WF
The average size of a new Whole Foods is 40,000 square feet (Short Pump store is 60,000 square feet) and the proposed footprint of the building is 41,000 square feet.
The developers have recently stated on a news interview that they are targeting 3-5 tenants, which means one of the below:
1) Whole Foods is no longer in the running.
2) It would be a Whole Foods about half the size of the Short Pump store to leave space for additional tenants. (seems unlikely)
If Whole Foods is interested in a store in the city, does anyone really think that they would give up if they don’t get this location?
Personally, I think it’s unlikely to be Whole Foods because: (1) they don’t like to go where they’re not wanted, or where there’s controversy, (2) they are probably smart enough not to cannabalize themselves by opening so close to their short pump location, (3) they simply wouldn’t fit with 2-4 other businesses in that footprint.
The only reason the Don’t Big Box Carytown campaign started was because their name was attached to the initial SUP application, and ET freaked out. They aren’t on any official documentation (LOI, etc), just rumors and innuendos. Instead of trying to keep your competitors out with a “grass roots” campaign, why not run them out of town with your outstanding product, prices, and service? Oh right, because they can’t. Maybe ET should focus on their business and not worry about who might or might not open one block over. I mean really, how many Thai restaurants are there in Carytown? Women’s clothing stores? Sushi restaurants? They all do what they do best, and share the marketplace.
I don’t understand why every time the requested zoning change is brought up in any article, the majority of comments are demonizing to Ellwood Thompson’s. I don’t want to take away from people’s opinions of ET’s, however, there is really no need for those opinions in this debate. Changing the zoning has nothing to do with ET. There are hundreds of individuals who have signed the petitions AGAINST the zoning change, and those individuals have nothing to do with ET. This is not about ET fighting against competition. This is about residents fighting against the zoning change. It is about individuals wanting to respect and adhere to the City’s master plan, and keep the buffer zone that is across from their homes. Kroger is expanding in an area that was already zoned to allow that expansion. If there really is a chance that Whole Foods would come to the City, why can’t they go ahead and take over the Martin’s location? Or put in a store on the Boulevard where it is already zoned appropriately?
I understand that once the Verizon Building is filled the City will be able to collect more taxes, however, don’t understand the argument that we should change zoning laws anytime there is a chance to make an extra buck. The only reason the building has yet to sell is because the owners have been asking for too high an amount for other developments to make sense there. The biggest problem with this whole equation is that the current owners are greedy, and therefore not able to sell. The City should not just change the zoning rules in order for the current owners to make more money. If we make it clear that the zoning is not going to change, then they will have to get more realistic with their sales price, and many local developers will be happy to come in and develop within the scope of the current zoning. Why isn’t this being talked about more?
The Richmond Society of Commercial Real Estate Bottom-Feeders would like to extend our sincere appreciation to the Richmond chapter of the Loyal Opposition to commercial and retail development. Your dedication to keep alternative uses limited, foster bureaucratic nit-picking, and maintain high vacancy rates yields lower and lower prices for the Bottom-Feeders. We are truly thankful for your ongoing contribution to our cause.
Why all the vitriol? ANY commercial development in the old Verizon building will bring more jobs to Richmond. Only one of the above comments mentions “jobs” as a benefit. Are there trade offs? Absolutely. We’re in the middle of a recession regardless of what they say on TV. Jobs are hard to come by. New business (regardless of who owns the new business) brings in jobs, and fosters economic growth. That’s a good thing.
As for traffic, competition, etc. those may be some of the trade offs, but they are trade offs that can be overcome. Ask any merchant in Carytown if they want more foot traffic in their stores. The answer is a resounding “yes”. As for competition, any good business owner realizes competition makes you stronger. A multi-tenant facility in the old Verizon building will bring shoppers, jobs and tax revenue while revitalizing a crumbling eyesore. I fail to see how any of that is bad.
Spoken like a true corporate pawn. Property values will go up, taxes will be paid, no traffic problems, won’t kill the competition…everyone will be happy, birds will be singing.
Maybe you should think for a moment about the impact Whole Food or similar corporate place would have on businesses around and on local economy in general. The businesses around buy local products, support local farmers, make their products by hiring local workers, pay taxes here, spend their profits in Richmond. With another corporate place, great strain will be put on these already struggling businesses. Eventually, when we bring more of these “Wal Mart” types close to Carytown, many of our local business won’t survive, as it happens in small towns across America when Wal Mart opens their stores. So your “great” property value increase, more jobs, will become less jobs for local businesses, people losing their homes, money earned in Virginia going somewhere else and other usual things.
Carytown is the jewel of this city, it represents something very unique and is one of the main reasons why I love Richmond. Moves like these will turn it in another Short Pump, with no spirit and no uniqueness.